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39 comments:
As we await the next UK Prime-Minister let's discuss another equally foul fiend...
Who's the best Dracula: Bela Lugosi, Christopher Lee or somebody else?
Somebody else: Ray Reardon.
Given the generational difference between Bella and the others… And having seen Bella and the others… My vote goes to Bella. My daughter and I saw the first Bella Dracula, four
Darn telephones, lol. When my daughter was 10 and I was about 45, we sat down to watch the first Dracula movie which featured Bella. Neither of us had seen it before. It had on the ends of our seats and it’s pretty impressive for a movie they must’ve been about 75 to 80 years old at the time, lol
Just to be awkward I pick Max Schreck from the 1922 film Nosferatu 😁
Colin, just last night, I was watching the first Hammer Dracula movie. However, regardless of Christopher Lee's strengths in the role, I shall agree with McScotty and go with Max Shreck. He seemed genuinely inhuman in a way that other Draculas never have.
Lugosi set the format on how the character should be portrayed, but Lee brought a sense of savagery to the role. Much like he did with Frankenstein & the Mummy. Lee also did an excellent job in Jess Franco's remake. One of the few GOOD Franco films.
Schreck definitely came forward with a sinister & ghostly performance in NOSFERATU. Kinski & Herzog did a fine job paying homage to him in their film.
Dan Curtis' DRACULA was probably one of the first to portray DRACULA as a tortured soul, outside of John Carradine in HOUSE OF DRACULA. Jack Palance almost topped Lee in being a foreboding threat.
Willam Defoe was wonderful as a "real life" Nosferatu in SHADOW OF THE VAMPIRE.
As a fan of Gary Oldman, since SID & NANCY, I feel he did a decent job considering who he had to work with.
One of the WORST portrayals of DRACULA I ever saw was Dario Argento's movie. Even though I dig his early films (SUSPIRIA, PHENOMENON, INFERNO, etc), that movie was a train wreck.
--Killdumpster
A pedant writes -
Actually, Max Schreck played Count Orlok in 'Nosferatu'.
I'm finding it hard to chose between Jack Palance - as drawn by Gene Colan in Tomb of Dracula, natch - and the Count from Sesame Street.
-sean
For years I owned the Universal DRACULA collection, but never watched the Spanish version that was filmed at the same time as the Lugosi movie. Everybody told me it was so much better, so I finally viewed it a few years ago.
The Mexican actor did not have the suave smoothness of Lugosi, but the actor that played Renfield blew Dwight Fry out-of-the-water.
-Killdumpster
Sean, oh my brother.
They used the Bram Stoker story as a template, and substituted "Orlock" for "Dracula" in an attempt not to pay royalties. The Stoker estate apparently sued.
The film was supposed to be destroyed, but Bullwinkle, that trick never works!
Sean-
Most horror-philes consider NOSFERATU the first full length Dracula film.
-Killdumpster
Well, if thats how it is, I'm going to change my preference and choose the star of 'Countess Dracula' (hey, it used Stoker as a template) Ingrid Pitt.
She made quite the impression on late Friday night tv during my adolescence...
-sean
Kinski played Renfield in Jess Franco's DRACULA, but he didn't want to be in another vampire film after being in Herzwog's NOSFERATU. He asked Franco, "This isn't a vampire movie, is it?"
Franco told him, "No."
Kinski also didn't want to do his scenes on a set. He demanded to do them in a authentic insane asylum cell.
Jess Franco told him that wouldn't be wise, as they might not let him out!
-Killdumpster
Might pop in DRACULA MEETS BILLY THE KID in the DVD player tonite, just for laughs.
Also with pickup a few Mars bars, at Steve's inadvertent suggestion, for "theater candy". Hadn't had one in awhile, especially since they have less almonds on them than in the '70's. Fifth Avenue bars used to have almonds also, topped all across the top. In the 80's the almonds were reduced to two, one on each end.
Don't know if the UK had Fifth Avenue bars. They were like Butterfinger or Clark bars with almonds on top. Heck, I'm unsure you folks had Clark bars.
-Killdumpster
Gotta disagree about Jess Franco's Dracula, Killskip - its terrible.
Even Christopher Lee didn't do a good job on that one. The moustache was a definite fail...
www.youtube.com/watch?v=709yTCAH3YI
About the only thing you can say for the film is that Soledad Miranda is in it (but she's not enough of a reason to sit through the thing).
-sean
Kd, we never had Fifth Avenue, Butterfinger or Clark bars.
And American Mars bars have almonds on top? Ours don't.
I'll mention Louis Jourdan who played Dracula in the BBC TV version at Christmas 1977.
Killskip. We get a lot of US chocolate bars, candy ( sweets) Crisps (chips) cereals etc in UK There are specialist US sweet shops and some larger newsagents sell some US bars. I've had a Clark bar but my favourite was a Baby Ruth
Sean-
I appreciate your opinion on Franco's DRACULA. it wasn't the best interpretation of the story, but with the budget Jess had, and compared to the boatloads of trash that man put out, it was one of his better films.
Also I agree with you on Soledad Miranda. Alot of Franco's movies are only watchable with her appearance. She left us too soon, and could've been a mainstream star.
-Killdumpster
Colin-
Been a loooong time since I had a Mars bar, but back in the 70s their commercial tag-line was "an almond in every bite". Each bar had 8 on top. Then 6 in the 80s. Then 4. I quit buying them after that.
That Louis Jourdan BBC DRACULA is pretty incredible. It's in my DVD library. I saw it on public tv when I was a kid, and was blown away when he brought a baby to his vampire brides.
McScotty-
I too enjoy an occasional Baby Ruth, as long as they're relatively fresh. When they stale-out the chocolate coating shatters, the peanuts fall off, and the nugget gets real chewy.
Mostly, for freshness sake, I stick to highsale standards like Snickers, Kit Kat, Nestle's Crunch, and Reese's Peanut Butter Cups when I have a flavor for sweets.
Occasionally I'll pick up Mallo Cups, as they're kinda hard to find, even here in the US. They were my Dad's favorite, and I highly recommend.
-Killdumpster
Colin-
Just stopped off to get beer for my DRACULA MEETS BILLY THE KID viewing, knowing that'd I'd need it. Checked out the candy area for Mars bars, but none available. I'll keep you updated when I come across them, and find out if they still have almonds over here. Lol.
-Killdumpster
Threw in my movie watch failsafe, microwave popcorn. One of the greatest inventions at the tale end of the 20th century.
-Killdumpster
I have a fondness for Lugosi’s iconic, campy vampy. When I was a kid I liked the two ‘Monster Rally’ movies, HOUSE OF FRANKENSTEIN and HOUSE OF DRACULA, except that I found John Carradine completely unacceptable as the Count. ABBOTT AND COSTELLO MEET FRANKENSTEIN is automatically better than those other two, for Bela’s presence alone.
The Spanish Dracula has been over-praised in some fan circles. Yes, the camera is more fluid than in the Tod Browning version, yes, Lupita Tovar is a thousand times hotter than Helen Chandler, etc etc — but the guy playing Dracula is awful, just kills it for me.
Agree that Lee’s Dracula was a commanding, scary, more dynamic screen Dracula. All the Hammer Dracula movies are watchable, though some are clearly better than others. The first one is great, of course, and DRACULA HAS RISEN FROM THE GRAVE is, for me, the most ‘fun’. I also get a kick out of DRACULA A.D. 72 for its tone-deaf ‘hip’ hippies.
I’m in the ‘Franco’s Dracula Sucks’ camp. ‘One of Franco’s better movies’ lowers the bar quite a bit, don’t it? Not much of a genuine recommendation. As for the moustache, I think that’s part of the reason Lee agreed to do the movie, because Franco told him it would be ‘faithful’ to the novel, including the facial fuzz. Apparently Lee forgot to read the dang script….
I’m not crazy about Louis Jordan as Dracula but the mini-series itself is quite good. Judi Bowker as Mina is super-adorable and Frank Finlay gets my vote as the best screen Van Helsing ever.
Palance is a pretty good Dracula in a pretty generic version of the story. Also, I kinda hate that ‘reincarnated lost love’ angle — here and in Coppola’s gonzo misfire too.
Yes, the original NOSFERATU is creepy as hell, and I remember liking Herzog’s remake with Klaus Kinski too — but it’s been literally decades since I last saw it so I can’t say how well it holds up.
How about ‘favorite Dracula COMIC BOOK’? The Wolfman/Colan/Palmer TOMB is an obvious all-around excellent choice, but there are other good ones too. I liked the short-lived Dracula series in EERIE, by Bill DuBay and Tom Sutton, mostly for the art. Sutton also had a terrific Dracula story in Marvel’s DRACULA LIVES mag. There’s also a pretty good b/w comic adaptation of the book by Otto Binder and Al McWilliams, published as a paperback in the early 60s. Oh, and a great fully-painted adaptation by Fernando Fernandez published as a graphic novel in the early 80s.
b.t.
b.t.
b.t.
b.t., oh my brother-
Just popped in on the middle of my viewing of DRAC VS BILLY (which I admit is awful, and even John Carradine regrets making, but I love cheesy cinema), and totally understand your dislike for Franco's DRACULA.
I've seen virtually everything that man's ever done, and still own many of his films in my library. Often I've gotten into arguments with my "monster pals" over him. I admit he was a goofy hack, but at least he made attempts. More or less.
I pick him over Jean Rollin. My god, TWIN VAMPIRE ORPHANS?!
I can't remember the title of some drek Rollin made where Dracula travels through time in a grandfather clock, and nuns smoke cigars.
LSD must've been good in France back then.
I did, and still own, NUDE VAMPIRE, though. The twist of vampires being mutants was novel.
- Killdumpster
b.t. I can't really see past Marvels Tomb of Dracula. However, Colan and Wolfman did a great series with Dark Horse called "The curse of Dracula" which was in effect a continuation of the Marvel classic with a younger looking more modern Dracula
What about the worst Dracula? 'Dead & Loving it', with George Hamilton?
Phillip
As for that secondary topic:
I’m not much of a fan of milk chocolate anymore, find it a little too buttery and sweet. My ‘grown-up’ pallette much prefers dark chocolate. But when I was younger, there wasn’t any such thing on the market.
Snickers and Baby Ruth were probably my two faves, but hell, when I was a kid, I liked just about ANY kind of chocolate candy bars. Mounds, Almond Joy, Nestle’s Crunch, $100,000 Bar, Milky Way, Three Musketeers etc. I know I used to like Clark bars and Mars bars but can barely remember what they taste like now.
Rocky Road is a fat rectangle of marshmallow covered in chocolate with little tiny bits of peanut mixed in (or maybe crispy rice bits — hard to tell, they’re so tiny). On very rare occasions, I’ll grab one if I see it out in the wild, enjoy those first couple of gooey, super-sugary bites and then hate myself afterwards. On even RARER occasions, I’ll find a DARK chocolate Rocky Road for sale and they’re practically irresistible.
b.t.
Phillip, DEAD AND LOVING IT was the Mel Brooks one with Leslie Nielsen (I’ve never seen it, but its reputation is dire). George Hamilton was in LOVE AT FIRST BITE, which I didn’t hate back in ‘79.
I’m not a fan of the John Badham DRACULA from that same year, with Frank Langella and Laurence Olivier.
But absolute WORST Dracula? Man, there’s so many. Gonna have to give it some thought.
b.t.
Incidentally, the commercial tag-line for the UK Mars bar was:
"A Mars a day, helps you work, rest, & play!"
This got parodied, with alternatives such as "A Mars a day, helps your teeth rot away!" etc.
Phillip
David Niven, in 'Vampira' (aka 'Old Dracula') b.t.?
I'm tempted to suggest Gary Oldman too, but its a bit unfair to blame him for the Coppola version.
Funny thing about that film - on release there was something about it that seemed familiar, that I couldn't quite put my finger on. Years later, I read that it was designed by Jaunty Jim Steranko, and suddenly it made sense - the intro has a total comic book vibe, and theres a real Steranko colour palette all the way through (Winona Ryder wearing bright green for instance).
Theres not much point in debating the best comic book Drac, as thats obviously the one by Wolfman, Colan & Palmer (that sounds like the name of a terrible 70s rock group, doesn't it?)
But seeing as you bought up Warren, its worth mentioning Esteban Maroto (especially as he seems to be largely forgotten these days) as he did quite a good Drac. Well, it looked good - as with Fernando Fernandez, theres not really any point in expecting much of a story.
I have a copy of the Marvel Classics 'Drac' somewhere, drawn by the awesome Nestor Redondo. Its ok, but not one of his best.
-sean
Obviously I was replying to b.t there about the worst Dracula. Only Phillip interrupted the flow and got in first... even though I checked after writing that comment!
-sean
PS b.t., against my better judgement, I like Dracula 1972 too!
And Killskip - theres something a bit strange going on in Jean Rollin's films, so for me he has it over Jess Franco (who's more straight forward exploitation). Admittedly I've not seen his Dracula film, but 'Requiem Pour Un Vampire' is great -
www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Cq5eBDk0B4
And he got Philippe Druillet to do some of his movie posters!
-sean
Sean: as regards Coppola’s DRACULA, I don’t know how much actual influence Steranko had on the finished product. I’ve only seen a piece or two of Steranko’s production concepts for the movie and they don’t look anything like the movie. In one painting, the castle looks very Art Deco and Dracula himself is long, lean, sporting a snow-white mullet and wearing what looks almost like a gestapo uniform.
And as for Gary Oldman, he’s an excellent actor, but I think he’s just miscast in that movie. Coppola’s hair and costume people didn’t do him any favors either. When it was released, i thought the movie was a fascinating failure, but the last time I watched it, a few years ago, I thought it was pretty much just a straight-up failure.
Oh, and speaking of Dracula comedies (as Phillip and I were, up-thread), Christopher Lee himself starred in two Dracula spoofs, both Italian IIRC — UNCLE WAS A VAMPIRE and DRACULA AND SON. I haven’t seen either one, but they’re both due to be released on BluRay sometime this year, as part of a CHRISTOPHER LEE EUROHORROR box set. A bit pricey to buy sight unseen, but I’ve always kinda wanted to see them….
b.t.
As regards, 'Love at First Bite', maybe some of the humour, in respect of casting, derived from the fact that Dracula, traditionally, was supposed to have a pale complexion, yet George Hamilton (playing Drac) was famous for over-using fake tan!
Phillip
How did George Hamilton ever become a star?
So b.t., am I over-estimating how much Jaunty Jim made Dracula great again then?
Fair enough - its not as if I actually know what he did on the film (not that I let that stop me having an opinion and going on about it).
Btw I think you nailed it there about the Coppola version, that in retrospect it seems more of a straight up failure than it did at the time. And it wasn't that good then.
-sean
Oooh, I was not aware of the 'Eurocrypt of Christopher Lee' boxes (two of 'em!) b.t., so thanks for that. Although they're a bit out of my price range too (actually, it never makes much sense to me to buy films anyway - really, how many times can you watch 'em?)
But I am enjoying checking them out -
www.youtube.com/watch?v=xlgTsO9BoHQ
"Satanic ceremonies will be happening in Britain tonight!"
-sean
Sean-
I'm going to check out Rollin's REQUIEM POR UN VAMPIRE. Half on your recommend, the other half that most of Rollin's films are at least wacky entertainment. After finishing BILLY THE KID VS DRACULA last night I re-watched SHRIEK OF THE VAMPIRES.
Just in case you didn't know, Rollin & Franco teamed-up to make ZOMBIE LAKE. What an incredible slice of cheesy goodness.
From my recollection, Hamilton's star value might have burst when he was in the Evel Knievel movie in the 70's. I'll never forget the line to the drive-in theater going back for MILES.
-Killdumpster
Having a video library is a wonderful thing. When there's nothing being presented/ broadcasted on regular TV, it's great to pop in an old favorite. With no commercials.
My collection is divided by genres, stars, and directors. I'm currently thinning out my library, as it's become a bit extensive. I eyeball each title, though. I'll keep any movie that's a fav, or I can't remember the ending. Also I have handfuls of DVDs that I haven't even cracked opened for future viewing in the winter months. Physical media is great.
Which comics also belongs in.
-Killdumpster
.
Thanks for all the comments :)
It's been very interesting to hear about all the varied Dracula actors and films but my favourite is still Christopher Lee and the Hammer films. Apparently when Christopher Lee started out as an actor he found it difficult to get work because he was "too foreign looking" but eventually he got cast as Dracula in 1957 and the rest is history.
At the end of the day, I would have to choose Lee as my favorite too, Colin.
Honestly, I think most of my fondness for Lugosi as Dracula comes more from having his image so directly identified with the character in the various mass media than from his actual performance in any of his rare movie appearances (just two — three, if you count RETURN OF THE VAMPIRE). I think I owned the Aurora Dracula model kit before I even saw the movie on TV.
b.t.
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