Thanks to Charlie Horse 47 and Killdumpster for their sponsorship of this post, via the magic of Patreon.
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| Image by Tumisu from Pixabay |
Cluelessness. It's a powerful force in the world and can explain almost everything that ever happens in it.
But there's a good side to cluelessness - and that's when I'm the one who doesn't have a clue.
And, right now, I don't possess such a thing because, as we open this web page, we find me plunging, once more, into the feature in which even I have no idea what's going on.
It's the feature in which you get to decide just what shall be the topic of the day.
Therefore, feel free to make your mark in the comments section below and we shall see just what congeals into order from the chaos and uncertainty of creation.
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17 comments:
Many Marvel heroes have ( evil or non-evil) counterparts. For example, Thor - Beta Ray Bill, Red Norvell, etc. Iron Man - War Machine, Titanium Man, the Guardsman (?), Rampage, etc. Captain America - 50s Cap, US Agent, the Patriot (others too numerous to mention). Spidey - Venom, Carnage, Tarantula (?), etc.
What's your favourite (or least favourite) superhero counterpart?
I've come up with this topic off the top of my head - so, if anyone can think of another, please go for it!
Phillip
Team counterparts - like the Super Skrull, for the FF - well, that's pushing it!
Phillip
Great question PHILLIP!
Charles is on the older side… sometimes when I fart dust comes out. So newer (???) characters like Beta Ray Bill, i have no thoughts on.
But I did really enjoy the 50s Cap stories in Captain America. I thought Boy Roy (?) did a nice job on Marvel continuity.
Iron Man and Titanium Man were classic too! But they only met twice, IIRC.
And as far as teams go, JSA-JLA was excellent for a young kid! And I was never bothered by alleged continuity issues. Earth 1, 2, Earth Fawcett (Cpt Marvels). Earth Quality (Plastic Man, Blackhawks, Doll Man…) was a concept that worked fine for me.
Question: does a counterpart necessarily mean that the hero and villain have extremely similar powers or just that they met each other frequently over the decades?
For instance, if someone were to say to me STILTMAN or GLADIATOR , I would immediately think of daredevil and no other superhero.
Charlie - To me, a counterpart is - if not a knock-off version of a character - a parody, in some sense. For example, Titanium Man was supposedly a tougher version of Iron Man ( reflecting competition between the Soviets & USA, in the 60s - Space race, missile gap - actually non-existent, etc.) "Iron Man, America? That's nothing - our champion is Titanium Man! He's like your Iron Man, but built from Titanium, which is stronger - and he's twice Iron Man's size!" ( In reality, you can damage Titanium with Cadmium (?), from a felt tip pen! ) Venom & Carnage are like much nastier, more hellish versions of Spidey (hence, I don't like them!) Of course, more benevolent counterparts exist, too. Like when Tony Stark, & Spidey persuade Happy Hogan, & Hobie, respectively, to dress in their costumes, so as to appear in two places at the same time, preventing their secret identities being exposed!
Considering my own question, I think counterparts based on Daredevil do not work well. When red-headed Mike Murdock (Daredevil) dressed as Thor in shades, the chances of anybody being fooled was minimal. Likewise, when the Fantastic Four thought Daredevil was Dr. Doom. And they have the cheek to call Matt Murdock blind!
I'm still mulling over my favourite counterpart - there are several contenders!
Phillip
Sorry, Charlie - I get what you're saying; you're making a more subtle point than mine, that's actually very clever. You mean a counterpart, in the sense that they complete the other character, in some way...
With that kind of definition...I'd say, for me, Mr.Fear is Daredevil's perfect counterpart, as, for a Man Without Fear - well, he's the perfect adversary. For Moon Knight, it would be Bushman, who represents Mark Spector's dark past he's fighting to gain redemption from.
Hmm - This topic has more scope if, rather than being specific, we give it free rein!
Phillip
Also, returning to parodies, there are anomalous counterparts. In Iron Man
# 106, shell-head's fighting a legion of Iron Men ( copies of his armour, made by Midas.) But, with multiplicity, the counterpart idea changes - it challenges the hero's very uniqueness! In Moon Knight, Lupinar sends a duplicate Moon Knight against Spector, thinking it will destabilize the already fragile balance of his mind (counterparts as psychological mindgames!)
Phillip
Red Guardian's a strange one. Surface level - he's to Captain America what Titanium Man is to Iron Man. However, Red Guardian becoming a female character raises questions...We've had She-Hulk, and Spider-woman, but has Captain America ever had a female equivalent? I suppose Ms.America (?), popping up in the Invaders, is a patriotic female character - but she's not a US female super-soldier counterpart to the female Red Guardian!
Phillip
Oh - in case I forget, before I retire for the night...I think it's somebody's birthday tomorrow...!!! I'll save the Happy Birthday until then ; )
Phillip
Phillip, when I try to rate the various ‘superhero counterparts’, I seriously can’t think of any that would qualify as a ‘favorite’. Beta Ray Bill, Thunderstrike, War Machine, Guardsman, Patriot, etc — they all just seem like less iconic (and ultimately less interesting) knockoffs. At the other end of the spectrum, I also find it difficult to decide which ones are my ‘least favorites’. Hmmmm, do I hate Carnage more than Venom? I dunno, toss a coin (I think they’re both crap)! Although I have to say, Tarantula is almost hilariously useless as a Spider-Man knock-off (his only super-power being a pair of Rosa Klebb shoes), so maybe he wins the ‘favorite Spidey counterpart’ category by default? I may have to give it much more thought….
While I struggle with all of this, I have a slight variation on your original question : are there any ‘superhero counterparts’ that you like MORE than the characters they’re ostensibly based on?
b.t.
Help Charlie?! Why would Tara tarantula be a counterpart to Spider-Man? Is it because they both are named after arachnids?
If so, would black widow be a counterpart to Spider-Man?
b.t. - Your question's definitely interesting! I should have thought this through more; but, rather than planning it in advance, I just ad-libbed it. Yes, I just plucked Tarantula's name out of the hat, as he's named after a Spider. He could just as easily be a Cap counterpart, as I think Tarantula had some super-soldier stuff (?) as backstory too (dangermash, any recollection?)
As regards, counterparts vs originals - I'd say Ms.Marvel was highly successful, as a character (probably the most successful knock-off ); but Captain Marvel, at his best, is extremely good - so I couldn't say she's better. At her best, almost as good!
I thought the Patriot was good - with Tuska & Marcos art. But obviously not as good as Cap!
Charlie - When the Black Widow first appeared (in Spidey), some counterpart stuff (both Spider-names) was implied - but, after that, it dwindled to nothing. At that rate, I suppose you could nominate Spider-woman, as a more 'spiderish' counterpart choice!
Steve : "Happy Birthday to you; happy birthday to you!...etc" Seriously, hope you have a nice day, and have some decent nosh tonight - maybe scoff a few Easter eggs!
Phillip
SING THE PRAISE!!! Happy birthday Steve! Thanks for all your selfless service that we fearless front facing FOOMERS drink from like a royal nectar from the literary gods!!!
Charlie Horse “Chinook” 47
Happy birthday, Steve - I think I've previously mentioned that you're only two days older than Nigel Farage.
Happy Birthday, Steve!
b.t.
Bt, Colin, Charlie and Phillip, thank you. :)
Ok. Charlie has been haunted by the 2 Superman - Flash covers of “Who is the fastest “ from the late 1960s IIRC.
Those two can be counter parts, no?!
Charlie - If Superman's powers are: 1.) Strength & invulnerability 2.) Eye-beams & flight 3.) Super speed - then, the Flash can be a one-third counterpart! There's Shazam Captain Marvel vs Superman too, I suppose!
https://www.comics.org/issue/68932/cover/4/
Phillip
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